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 Post subject: Little Question for check synchronization system
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 1:26 pm 
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I know that my ideas you do not like. But I have to ask. Whether it be in some way, for the map (perhaps through SAIL), are check synchronization off, I mean really Just check not synchronization itself.
(Just to discard the system, which kicked players from game, because of it)
Desynchronization, we already have quite a lot, and we are willing to at least try to play with less desynchronization.

You do not take it as offensive, please. Just ask if there is such possibility. We would like to try.

--------------------------------------------

Já vím, že mé nápady nemáte moc rád. Ale musím se zeptat. Zda je možné nějakým způsobem, pro mapu (třeba přes SAIL), vypnout kontrolu synchronizace, myslím opravdu jen kontrolu nikoli synchronizaci samotnou.
(Jen vyřadit systém, který vyhrazuje hráče ze hry, kvůli tomu)
Desynchronizací, máme už celkem dost, a jsme ochotní to aspoň zkusit hrát s menší desynchronizací.

vy to neberte jako utok, prosím. Jen se ptám jestli tu je taková možnost. Chtěli bychom to aspon zkusit.


Last edited by Sali on Wed Apr 06, 2011 1:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Little Question for check synchronization system
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 1:41 pm 
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You can't turn it off. You would have lots of inconsistencies. You would also proberly get errors popping up.

To reduce Synchronisation errors you need to make sure the connection between all players is good. If you have 2 people who have a poor ping between them then they are more likely to have problems due to it. Also certain maps can increase the chance of Synchronisation loss.

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 Post subject: Re: Little Question for check synchronization system
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 1:52 pm 
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The problem is that the connection is perfect. (There's nothing better than an opto LAN cable)
If desnychronizace minimal levels during the time (like that character is a hex on and so on .. I compare the pitch nearly or just as soon as you move.)
Strange also is that the game retains the synchronization at the fall of the Internet, and of later burn on trivialities.
In short, we believe that the game does not desynchronization, and not least because such a game should end, because it would turn synchronized itself.
Yes, I know there is a risk that in the game occur in absurdity, but it is a risk that we would do if we get a possibility.

That's all I ask, the possibility for us to try.
Maybe it's better to absurdity, than crash the game. (Of course it depends on the level of absurdity)
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Problém je, že spojení je dokonalé. (neni nic lepšího než opto lan kabel)
Pokud je desnychronizace minimalní, srovná se behem chvíle (jako že postava stojí o hex dál a podobně.. se srovnají témeř hned, jak se pohne.)
Divné též je, že hra udrží synchronizaci i při pádu internetu, a pozděj vyhoří na prkotině.
Zkráceně se domníváme, že hra nevytváří desynchronizaci, nebo ne aspoň takovou kvůli který by hra měla skončit, protože by se zase synchronizovala sama.
Ano, vím, je riziko, že ve hře vzniknou nesmyslnosti, ale je to risk který jsme ochotný udělat, pokud dostanem takovou možnost.

To je vše co žadám, možnost pro nás to aspoň zkusit.
Možná je lepší nesmyslnost, než pád hry. (samozřejmě záleží na urovni nesmyslnosti)


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 Post subject: Re: Little Question for check synchronization system
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 3:07 pm 
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Due to my research and experience, sync losts are caused only by SAIL. This isn't only about bugs in script. The interpreter is hell buggy. Anyway, according to results of several tests: loosing connection is mainly a cause of a lag or "waiting for player" or immediate exit. I couldn't reproduce a sync lost.


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 Post subject: Re: Little Question for check synchronization system
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 3:38 pm 
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Loosing connection never has anything to do with Desyncronisation.

Desyncronisation is when you have one of two events:

1. Packets are lost, as a result one or more players never got packets telling them to add a vehicle/whatever.
2. Buggy Sail, where in certain situations it will do different things for different people.

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 Post subject: Re: Little Question for check synchronization system
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 4:02 pm 
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1) Nope. Really, I've tried. The game seems to revive by itself.
2) Sure. It's the simplest solution. However, it's possible to get sync lost when playing on the same computer and having proper code. So it seems to be an internal error.


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 Post subject: Re: Little Question for check synchronization system
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 4:17 pm 
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There are two things which trip the system.

1. A Tick has expired. (I assume packet loss would cause this)
2. One or more players Tick is different.

I could make it not throw an error when a tick is late, but i don't see how it would be the cause for lan games.

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 Post subject: Re: Little Question for check synchronization system
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 4:25 pm 
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It doesn't give an error. It simply shows the sync lost message.
In simpler words: OW's synchronization system is... odd.


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 Post subject: Re: Little Question for check synchronization system
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 4:41 pm 
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By error i ment the whole Syncronisation lost message... Kinda obvious what i ment.

Code:
    if expired then
      begin
        err:=inttostr(tick)+': Waiting for synchronization tick '+inttostr(p^.tick)+' ';
        for i:=0 to Multidef.PlayerCount-1 do
          if Multidef.Players[i].Alive then
            if not p^.received[i] then
              err:=err+'('+Multidef.Players[i].Name+') ';
        err:=err+'expired.';
      end
    else if not chybi and chyba then
      begin
        err:=inttostr(tick)+': Synchronization from tick '+inttostr(p^.tick)+' failed: ';
        for i:=0 to Multidef.PlayerCount-1 do
          if Multidef.Players[i].Alive then
            if p^.received[i] then
              err:=err+Multidef.Players[i].Name+'('+inttostr(p^.values[i])+'); ';
      end


^ Only when one of the two things above are true will it give a sync lost message. The err variable is local to the procedure which checks for sync lost's but its never assigned to any other variable, so its never used.....

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 Post subject: Re: Little Question for check synchronization system
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 8:33 pm 
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Stu, can you create a mini patch to 1.11, which would rule out the kicked of the player at desynchronization (eg, shutdown command through SAIL it is no matter what)? We want least try it, we are convinced that no desynchronization, just stupid evaluated. We want to try it, please, at least we will move on and show that you have to be right.

You give us the opportunity to at least try, please.

BTW, the connection is lost with 100% packet loss and cause not a desynchronization,
while waiting for the players, the game does not crash ever.
---------------------------

Stu, mohl by jste vytvořit mini patch na 1.11, který by vyřazoval vyhození hráče při desynchronizaci (třeba, vypnutí příkazem přes SAIL to je už jedno jak)? Chceme to aspoň zkusit, jsme přesvědčení že k desynchronizaci nedochází, jen to blbě vyhodnocuje. Chcem to zkusit, prosím, aspoň se posuneme dál a ukážete třeba že máte pravdu.

prosím, dejte nám možnost to aspoň vyzkoušet.

Mimochodem, při ztrátě spojení se 100% ztraty paketu a nezpůsobí to desynchronizaci,
při čekání na hráče, nikdy hra nepadala.


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 Post subject: Re: Little Question for check synchronization system
PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 5:23 am 
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Attached is a version which will ignore all Sync Losts, but will generate silent error logs when they happen, There will be no notification when they are created so you would have to check to see if there were any error logs generated after the game to see if there was a Sync Lost.

If this causes the game to throw up an error instead i have no clue. Let me know if you get any error logs appearing.

Note: This version has Radzio's Broadcast Code.


Attachments:
OwarFull.rar [956.4 KiB]
Downloaded 90 times

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 Post subject: Re: Little Question for check synchronization system
PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 12:34 pm 
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Thanks you, about results we will inform you.


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 Post subject: Re: Little Question for check synchronization system
PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 9:39 pm 
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When desynchronization occurs for cutting the game (lags not because of lags in Lagache the game hangs when it goes on but the picture tears) I think this is due to excessive write to file error logs.

(this is first result, with the first desynchronization)
during the few seconds it created 30 files, but the game within 10 seconds back synchronized (interestingly, it seems that the game can build sync back after few seconds)

Tests will continue to run
-----------------------------
Při desynchronizaci dochazí k sekání hry (lags ne protože při lagách se hra zasekne, při tom beží dál ale obraz se trhá) myslím že je to z důvodu nadměrného zapisování do souboru s error logy

(toto je první výsledek s první desynchronizací)
během pár vteřin to vytvořilo 30 souborů, ale hra se do 10 vteřin zpět synchronizovala (zajimavé, vypadá to že hra dokáže navázat zpět synchronizaci po pár vteřinách)

testy budou nadále probíhat


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 Post subject: Re: Little Question for check synchronization system
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 8:22 am 
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What does the log say? I should upgrade the error system so its like the one in Tarr Chronicles/Dark Horizon, which is based on Original War's one but has some nice improvements (Like only creating one error log but allowing it to record multiple error messages).

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 Post subject: Re: Little Question for check synchronization system
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 12:38 pm 
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ErrorType : Unknown
ErrorText : 2590: Synchronization from tick 2585 failed: «XR»Sali(968794000); «XR»keal(-1673138856);

ErrorText : 35320: Synchronization from tick 35305 failed: «XR»Sali(-1315212183); PIXAR(-1315212190); «XR»Enguzrad(-1315212183); «XR»keal(-1315212190);

In all files are some, only the numbers change.


Last edited by Sali on Fri Apr 08, 2011 3:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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